The priority for LA and Calif Government (all controlled by Dems) is NOT the good tax paying citizens. Their priority is for none human things (trees, smelt, bushes etc) and deviants of society who contribute only crime and self indulgence (pimps, pushers, addicts, takers of society). I still think the voters of CA did NOT vote for these liberal crooks. The elections are stolen!!
Our election processes do need serious reform, so they are not subject to even possible charges of "stolen elections", including the highly dubious California "long counts" reputation. Time to learn how Florida does it right, which gets their results out immediately.
Conspiracy theories are nice and easy, but I assure you that the people of this state have been that disconnected from reality that they DID vote for them. However, this may well be the thing that wakes them up and hopefully, Newsom, his allies in the legislature, and Bass will all be voted out or recalled.
Eco-terrorists refusal to install fire breaks and maintain forest access roads can also be added to this list of forest management failures.
What exactly took place for the several hours between a time-stamped LAX runway video taking note of the early plumes of smoke in the surrounding foothills, and the later conflagrations sweeping across to Malibu?
Was there road access and was their ready equipment for an emergency response to those first reported flames? What was the source of initial conflagration in that urban interface area? How easy to keep sweeping these critical enquiries under the long over-used "climate change" dumpster.
How and why did we let this leftist "progressive" propaganda take such a solid grip creating this willful blindness?
Great summary, Robert, of a situation where additional abuse by the incumbents will continue to be uncovered. Sorry for the loss of all those who voted against the incumbents. The Newsom group will want an investigation that they can send to "investigation heaven" along with the ones for the assignation of President Kennedy and Hunters laptop.
"As Los Angeles Burns, Mayor Rowse Sends a [Fake] Message to Santa Barbara"
"One of the prices we pay for that is constant exposure to natural disaster from fire, earthquake, and extreme weather events. Each of us has an inherent duty to be prepared."
The Threat is the FOLKS IN SB GOVERNANCE just as down in LA and in the STATE OF CA.
Great writing, Robert. I predict the actual cost will approach a trillion dollars for the LA fire which will warm the cockles of the California Dem politician hearts. If Trump and Musk have anything to do with this mess, they will take the task of rebuilding and remove the current LA so-called political "leaders." This will be a huge win-win for Trump and a huge lose-lose for all the Dems.
The politicians don't care if the tax revenues go down. The fire rebuilding revenue is what they have their eye on. This revenue breaks out into many directions for them to tap into. The fire revenue, a big bundle of money, will be more difficult to track as to whether or not it goes where it's supposed to. Take a little here and there.
The Dem politicians could tell their family members it's a good time to be a contractor, whether you do anything or not. Just have a bank account to receive money and you (and many others) did the work as inspected by the city building inspectors.
How much of the town of Paradise has been rebuilt? Past shall be prologue when it comes to fire recovery lessons. Looks like a quickly built new suburb today, but with lots of defensible spaces around the new homes:
This state and county just kowtows to the low lifes that slip into our cities to steal, murder and rape. These are not good people. Start protecting the honest tax paying citizens and rid the country of these no good people.
During another life when I was a caveman, I learned a few things about fire. First thing it takes something called fuel to burn, such as brush and dead trees. Second thing you needed was fire to burn the fuel. And third thing was water to put out the fire. Three things you need when dealing with fires: fuel, fire and water. I estimate I learned that about 25,000 years ago. I also learned it wasn't always the best thing to live where there are a lot of burnable things. It was always better to take burnable material and bring it to a place that would not burn. And I remember all those things very well. What is wrong with these people where they congregate in large numbers, living amongst lots of fuel, only requiring two sticks to rub together and burn the whole place down!
How about Newsom call for a special legislative session of the state assembly to deal with the massive fires? Oh wait, Newsom already called for one to torpedo the incoming Trump administration in which some $20 million was pledged to fight against policies which we voted for! This is too crooked to make up.
With everbody hosing their houses down and the FD using hydrants they ran the tank dry. The same system exists all over, Hope ranch for example. And since when are the water tanks part of the response pattern?
Cue the blame game. Sorry to break it to you, but a battalion of politicians, every fire engine in the world and the whole pacfic ocean won’t stop a fire in low RH high wind driven events. After the catastrophic fires of 1970, politicians DID create FIRESCOPE, an incident management system that has been used successfully all over the world. However, when Mother Nature is in the drivers seat, its a whole different story.
AR: Tell us more about what happened during the recorded several hours between the first reported fire sighting, and its eventual sweep hours later across the city? What do 'first responders" do when they get the first call.
Should there have not been a lot more stress testing modeling going on up front considering the known knowns always present in this area. A least to justify the huge top heavy administrative compensation costs for LAFD as reported on Transparent California.
Not a word of speculation whatsoever, Dan. These are the critical on the ground questions that must be answered. View the LAX video of their recoded first fire sightings.
Joan, let's pretend we are in a courtroom and I'm the judge. Your comment to Andy was speculation. You asked him to tell you about the hours . . . blah, blah, blah. Andy is under no obligation to answer you leading question. So as the judge here I rule you comment is out of order.
To prove your point you should offer evidence, not ask Andy or anyone else to view videos. We all know those can be tampered with.
What does a "first responder" do in those first hours knowing a major conflagration has started, since they are obviously tasked to respond first.
The question is general, not specifically directed to any one person. We all need to be asking these question. We all need to learn from what just happened.
You just asked to pretend we are in a court room. When we are not. Same thing. I assume you are looking for new perspectives. Join the group.
For the record, James Woods house was saved, while homes right across the street were lost. Fire breaks and defensive spaces shall be the new norm when any rebuilding takes place.
Stolen LF fire hydrants? I don't see any LA fire hydrants on eBay. Where are they going to? Is Newscum collecting these heavy things? The Dems will say the hydrants were taken by some rich guy to build Elonwood to replace Hollywood. Regardless, hydrants are one heck of a paper weight maybe used for Dem crimes. Interesting how the Getty Musuem had their fire prevention act together and still stands. The have water reserves, clear out brush ... all the things the rest of LA should have done. Doubled layered walls of the museum helps, too!
It's called recycled metals that are now taken to Mexico. It is happening everywhere. They go on roofs and steal copper fittings of A/C units etc. So common now, that recycle centers have pictures of fire hydrants stating they will not take.
Just out of curiosity, how do they turn-off the water to the fire hydrants in order to remove them? Do the culprits know where the main water valves are located? Seems like a lot of work for something basic ... cast iron.
We’ve replace 4 backflow valves to 3 commercial building in Lompoc. In 2 cases there values in front in the other they just cut and let the water spew! Our cost $3500Ea. They value maybe 125$ brass In one case they know we have to replace it immediately so you can flush your toilet, and so they just come back by three days later and repeat!!
Are there plastic versions of these valves. Place a housing around the valve with an alarm? There are strong enough, machinable plastics ... maybe a business for someone. I had a backflow valve in an irrigation system, they can be complicated. Is this a "California" thing where a criminal is caught stealing a backflow valve and they walk out of jail?
cathy dunca good questions. Here’s what I got after deeper dive to a fairly business friendly city of Lompoc. They are located adjacent to the Main Street water supply so typically alongside a road. Code is you can’t just put a cage around it ( too ugly!). Also in one case where property is already surround by an approved fencing. They just cut right thru it. (We paid extra to repair that fence too) those cool new battery powered tools make it a 2min job. Lastly I’ll check into plastic. I don’t fully understand the backflow valve internal mechanics - but I bet that has something to do with it
Crooks. And even they “hired works of functional meth heads shy away from danger - be it razor wire around the values , or better still- go back to 3 strike laws. We know that works and actually scares some people straight.
If this is a common enough event, then the city should offer a solution to this problem, check with the water department. Setting up a camera could identify the people or vehicles. Check to see if there is a place where a camera could be placed without someone noticing them. I'd have one or two cameras on the valve and two looking at both directions on the street. The street cameras should be a quality that will identify the cars and make the license plates readable. Maybe the city can setup cameras for a sting. If there are not plastic backflow valves, someone should go in business to make them. Cast brass valves have about 66% copper and the rest in zinc. The copper can be extracted by electrodeposition using an acid. I'm surprised someone is willing to take the risk of being caught stealing valves. And yes, battery operated tools are very good at quietly cutting through metal. Maybe figure out how to get footprints. If there's wet dirt around where it is stolen, make the area so it will create a footprint. If the city isn't interested in a sting, set a trigger in the ground to be activated and have it sound an alarm. Might have a conversation with a security company. I'm sure they'd have a lot of good ideas.
Robert Eringer reports: "California isn’t unique in its forests. In fact, there are countries with denser, larger, and even more flammable forest ecosystems that somehow manage to avoid this level of devastation. Take countries like Finland, Sweden, or Canada, places with massive forests, harsh winters, and dry summers. Why California? Two words: forest management."
Well, I think anyone who has looked at a world globe can intuit why Finland, Sweden and Canada might have a lower incident of wildfires; they are located in the cooler, wetter, mosquito-ier far northern climes.
To wit: Canada receives an average of 35" of rain annually, compared to California's 23" (and Southern California only 14" average). Similarly: Sweden gets about 31" and Finland 27". The author also fails to mention that Canada--despite its implied superior "fire management"--lost 13 million acres to wildfires last year, compared to some 8.1m acres across the entire U.S., of which 1,050,000 acres burned in California (which is almost exactly how many acres burned in "red" state Idaho).
Then there is also the our inherent hot, dry, blustery Santa Ana winds--which those aforementioned countries don't have--that is the primary driver behind the current conflagrations here in California.
So, Eringer's claim that those countries are "even more flammable" than California is specious at best, and an outright lie at worst. Again: why not just tell the truth?
Author asks: "Take countries like Finland, Sweden, or Canada, places with massive forests, harsh winters, and dry summers. Why California?"
These are all socialist countries with well managed forests, along with well managed universal health care. California forests and open spaces require periodic cultural burns to eliminate the build up of combustible fuel and remove invasive plants so that the seeds of native plants and trees that require periodic fire to initiate growth, can sprout. Houses built in burn areas prohibit these cultural burns, so the fuel builds up and creates the devastating fires we are experiencing, and not just in California. All fires will eventually burn themselves out, so "fighting" the fires, with the enormous cost to taxpayers, is actually unnecessary. Treat a "burn zone" like a "flood zone" and build accordingly.
Scandinavian countries are actually capitalist (58 billionaires in Norway last time I checked) but they tax heavily and make far better use of the money they obtain from taxes.
Socialist countries are ones where by definition, the government owns all means of production.
I believe you are confusing "socialism" with "communism." Socialism and communism are two different ideologies that have some similarities in practice. Communism eliminates private property in the hopes of creating equality, whereas a socialist country, like Norway, seeks greater equality by creating more equal distribution of wealth.
I’m not privy to the response scenario, but I’d be surprised if the original incident commander didn’t basically ask for a huge subsequent response. All departments pretty much do lots of pre planning and mitigation in interface areas. Usually initial response scenarios are stepped up a lot under red flag conditions. Can’t control the wind and RH. I think if you look into FIRESCOPE and how California responds to such incidents you’ll find that the response model is pretty good. The REAL challenge here is going to be in the insurance industry’s response to this, and how the locals and state work it out.
The priority for LA and Calif Government (all controlled by Dems) is NOT the good tax paying citizens. Their priority is for none human things (trees, smelt, bushes etc) and deviants of society who contribute only crime and self indulgence (pimps, pushers, addicts, takers of society). I still think the voters of CA did NOT vote for these liberal crooks. The elections are stolen!!
Our election processes do need serious reform, so they are not subject to even possible charges of "stolen elections", including the highly dubious California "long counts" reputation. Time to learn how Florida does it right, which gets their results out immediately.
Conspiracy theories are nice and easy, but I assure you that the people of this state have been that disconnected from reality that they DID vote for them. However, this may well be the thing that wakes them up and hopefully, Newsom, his allies in the legislature, and Bass will all be voted out or recalled.
Eco-terrorists refusal to install fire breaks and maintain forest access roads can also be added to this list of forest management failures.
What exactly took place for the several hours between a time-stamped LAX runway video taking note of the early plumes of smoke in the surrounding foothills, and the later conflagrations sweeping across to Malibu?
Was there road access and was their ready equipment for an emergency response to those first reported flames? What was the source of initial conflagration in that urban interface area? How easy to keep sweeping these critical enquiries under the long over-used "climate change" dumpster.
How and why did we let this leftist "progressive" propaganda take such a solid grip creating this willful blindness?
Great summary, Robert, of a situation where additional abuse by the incumbents will continue to be uncovered. Sorry for the loss of all those who voted against the incumbents. The Newsom group will want an investigation that they can send to "investigation heaven" along with the ones for the assignation of President Kennedy and Hunters laptop.
I read this article by Mr. Eringer Titled "La Inferno and Demo Debacle"
that should read "Incompetent and Corrupt Leadership"
I could not better state the REAL LEADSHIP DEBACLE better than
these two individuals Weiss and O'Reilly weblinks and quotes below>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHd3XAMVDzE&ab_channel=FoxNews
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkdNrDhUELs&t=630s&ab_channel=NewsNation
Weiss>"LA and CA is being Governed by People who have lost sight of Basics of Governing.
O"Reilly > It is stunning your whole life can disappear ... and it is a MESSAGE." and
"Progressive Governance DOES NOT WORK."
In Conclusion MOVE OUT OF CALI or be Destroyed. That is what I did.
Howard Walther Member of a Military Family
PS1 - From our SB Mayor and I quote from weblink below>
https://www.independent.com/2025/01/10/as-los-angeles-burns-santa-barbara-mayor-sends-a-message-to-the-city/
"As Los Angeles Burns, Mayor Rowse Sends a [Fake] Message to Santa Barbara"
"One of the prices we pay for that is constant exposure to natural disaster from fire, earthquake, and extreme weather events. Each of us has an inherent duty to be prepared."
The Threat is the FOLKS IN SB GOVERNANCE just as down in LA and in the STATE OF CA.
Great writing, Robert. I predict the actual cost will approach a trillion dollars for the LA fire which will warm the cockles of the California Dem politician hearts. If Trump and Musk have anything to do with this mess, they will take the task of rebuilding and remove the current LA so-called political "leaders." This will be a huge win-win for Trump and a huge lose-lose for all the Dems.
What will the fire do to LA property tax revenues?
The politicians don't care if the tax revenues go down. The fire rebuilding revenue is what they have their eye on. This revenue breaks out into many directions for them to tap into. The fire revenue, a big bundle of money, will be more difficult to track as to whether or not it goes where it's supposed to. Take a little here and there.
The Dem politicians could tell their family members it's a good time to be a contractor, whether you do anything or not. Just have a bank account to receive money and you (and many others) did the work as inspected by the city building inspectors.
How much of the town of Paradise has been rebuilt? Past shall be prologue when it comes to fire recovery lessons. Looks like a quickly built new suburb today, but with lots of defensible spaces around the new homes:
https://www.zillow.com/paradise-ca/
This state and county just kowtows to the low lifes that slip into our cities to steal, murder and rape. These are not good people. Start protecting the honest tax paying citizens and rid the country of these no good people.
During another life when I was a caveman, I learned a few things about fire. First thing it takes something called fuel to burn, such as brush and dead trees. Second thing you needed was fire to burn the fuel. And third thing was water to put out the fire. Three things you need when dealing with fires: fuel, fire and water. I estimate I learned that about 25,000 years ago. I also learned it wasn't always the best thing to live where there are a lot of burnable things. It was always better to take burnable material and bring it to a place that would not burn. And I remember all those things very well. What is wrong with these people where they congregate in large numbers, living amongst lots of fuel, only requiring two sticks to rub together and burn the whole place down!
How about Newsom call for a special legislative session of the state assembly to deal with the massive fires? Oh wait, Newsom already called for one to torpedo the incoming Trump administration in which some $20 million was pledged to fight against policies which we voted for! This is too crooked to make up.
ALL PATHETIC....glad we don't live down there now.
J
With everbody hosing their houses down and the FD using hydrants they ran the tank dry. The same system exists all over, Hope ranch for example. And since when are the water tanks part of the response pattern?
Cue the blame game. Sorry to break it to you, but a battalion of politicians, every fire engine in the world and the whole pacfic ocean won’t stop a fire in low RH high wind driven events. After the catastrophic fires of 1970, politicians DID create FIRESCOPE, an incident management system that has been used successfully all over the world. However, when Mother Nature is in the drivers seat, its a whole different story.
AR: Tell us more about what happened during the recorded several hours between the first reported fire sighting, and its eventual sweep hours later across the city? What do 'first responders" do when they get the first call.
Should there have not been a lot more stress testing modeling going on up front considering the known knowns always present in this area. A least to justify the huge top heavy administrative compensation costs for LAFD as reported on Transparent California.
Joan, please stop with the speculations.
Joan is correct.
Please explain.
She’s not speculating.
Not a word of speculation whatsoever, Dan. These are the critical on the ground questions that must be answered. View the LAX video of their recoded first fire sightings.
Joan, let's pretend we are in a courtroom and I'm the judge. Your comment to Andy was speculation. You asked him to tell you about the hours . . . blah, blah, blah. Andy is under no obligation to answer you leading question. So as the judge here I rule you comment is out of order.
To prove your point you should offer evidence, not ask Andy or anyone else to view videos. We all know those can be tampered with.
What does a "first responder" do in those first hours knowing a major conflagration has started, since they are obviously tasked to respond first.
The question is general, not specifically directed to any one person. We all need to be asking these question. We all need to learn from what just happened.
You just asked to pretend we are in a court room. When we are not. Same thing. I assume you are looking for new perspectives. Join the group.
For the record, James Woods house was saved, while homes right across the street were lost. Fire breaks and defensive spaces shall be the new norm when any rebuilding takes place.
Stolen LF fire hydrants? I don't see any LA fire hydrants on eBay. Where are they going to? Is Newscum collecting these heavy things? The Dems will say the hydrants were taken by some rich guy to build Elonwood to replace Hollywood. Regardless, hydrants are one heck of a paper weight maybe used for Dem crimes. Interesting how the Getty Musuem had their fire prevention act together and still stands. The have water reserves, clear out brush ... all the things the rest of LA should have done. Doubled layered walls of the museum helps, too!
It's called recycled metals that are now taken to Mexico. It is happening everywhere. They go on roofs and steal copper fittings of A/C units etc. So common now, that recycle centers have pictures of fire hydrants stating they will not take.
Funny, won't take stolen fire hydrants, but stolen everything else is OK.
Next thing someone will be stealing the decorative lights. Those old ones in Pasadena are probably worth something.
A lot of stolen metal is finding a market. Take the profit out of stolen catalytic converters, copper wire, and now yes, stolen fire hydrant parts.
Just out of curiosity, how do they turn-off the water to the fire hydrants in order to remove them? Do the culprits know where the main water valves are located? Seems like a lot of work for something basic ... cast iron.
Maybe they know upfront which ones no longer even have water running into them?
I sort of picked up that there were non-working hydrants. Geez, I thought that would be difficult to do ... install a hydrant without any water!
We’ve replace 4 backflow valves to 3 commercial building in Lompoc. In 2 cases there values in front in the other they just cut and let the water spew! Our cost $3500Ea. They value maybe 125$ brass In one case they know we have to replace it immediately so you can flush your toilet, and so they just come back by three days later and repeat!!
Are there plastic versions of these valves. Place a housing around the valve with an alarm? There are strong enough, machinable plastics ... maybe a business for someone. I had a backflow valve in an irrigation system, they can be complicated. Is this a "California" thing where a criminal is caught stealing a backflow valve and they walk out of jail?
cathy dunca good questions. Here’s what I got after deeper dive to a fairly business friendly city of Lompoc. They are located adjacent to the Main Street water supply so typically alongside a road. Code is you can’t just put a cage around it ( too ugly!). Also in one case where property is already surround by an approved fencing. They just cut right thru it. (We paid extra to repair that fence too) those cool new battery powered tools make it a 2min job. Lastly I’ll check into plastic. I don’t fully understand the backflow valve internal mechanics - but I bet that has something to do with it
Crooks. And even they “hired works of functional meth heads shy away from danger - be it razor wire around the values , or better still- go back to 3 strike laws. We know that works and actually scares some people straight.
If this is a common enough event, then the city should offer a solution to this problem, check with the water department. Setting up a camera could identify the people or vehicles. Check to see if there is a place where a camera could be placed without someone noticing them. I'd have one or two cameras on the valve and two looking at both directions on the street. The street cameras should be a quality that will identify the cars and make the license plates readable. Maybe the city can setup cameras for a sting. If there are not plastic backflow valves, someone should go in business to make them. Cast brass valves have about 66% copper and the rest in zinc. The copper can be extracted by electrodeposition using an acid. I'm surprised someone is willing to take the risk of being caught stealing valves. And yes, battery operated tools are very good at quietly cutting through metal. Maybe figure out how to get footprints. If there's wet dirt around where it is stolen, make the area so it will create a footprint. If the city isn't interested in a sting, set a trigger in the ground to be activated and have it sound an alarm. Might have a conversation with a security company. I'm sure they'd have a lot of good ideas.
Robert Eringer reports: "California isn’t unique in its forests. In fact, there are countries with denser, larger, and even more flammable forest ecosystems that somehow manage to avoid this level of devastation. Take countries like Finland, Sweden, or Canada, places with massive forests, harsh winters, and dry summers. Why California? Two words: forest management."
Well, I think anyone who has looked at a world globe can intuit why Finland, Sweden and Canada might have a lower incident of wildfires; they are located in the cooler, wetter, mosquito-ier far northern climes.
To wit: Canada receives an average of 35" of rain annually, compared to California's 23" (and Southern California only 14" average). Similarly: Sweden gets about 31" and Finland 27". The author also fails to mention that Canada--despite its implied superior "fire management"--lost 13 million acres to wildfires last year, compared to some 8.1m acres across the entire U.S., of which 1,050,000 acres burned in California (which is almost exactly how many acres burned in "red" state Idaho).
Then there is also the our inherent hot, dry, blustery Santa Ana winds--which those aforementioned countries don't have--that is the primary driver behind the current conflagrations here in California.
So, Eringer's claim that those countries are "even more flammable" than California is specious at best, and an outright lie at worst. Again: why not just tell the truth?
Author asks: "Take countries like Finland, Sweden, or Canada, places with massive forests, harsh winters, and dry summers. Why California?"
These are all socialist countries with well managed forests, along with well managed universal health care. California forests and open spaces require periodic cultural burns to eliminate the build up of combustible fuel and remove invasive plants so that the seeds of native plants and trees that require periodic fire to initiate growth, can sprout. Houses built in burn areas prohibit these cultural burns, so the fuel builds up and creates the devastating fires we are experiencing, and not just in California. All fires will eventually burn themselves out, so "fighting" the fires, with the enormous cost to taxpayers, is actually unnecessary. Treat a "burn zone" like a "flood zone" and build accordingly.
Scandinavian countries are actually capitalist (58 billionaires in Norway last time I checked) but they tax heavily and make far better use of the money they obtain from taxes.
Socialist countries are ones where by definition, the government owns all means of production.
I believe you are confusing "socialism" with "communism." Socialism and communism are two different ideologies that have some similarities in practice. Communism eliminates private property in the hopes of creating equality, whereas a socialist country, like Norway, seeks greater equality by creating more equal distribution of wealth.
I’m not privy to the response scenario, but I’d be surprised if the original incident commander didn’t basically ask for a huge subsequent response. All departments pretty much do lots of pre planning and mitigation in interface areas. Usually initial response scenarios are stepped up a lot under red flag conditions. Can’t control the wind and RH. I think if you look into FIRESCOPE and how California responds to such incidents you’ll find that the response model is pretty good. The REAL challenge here is going to be in the insurance industry’s response to this, and how the locals and state work it out.
Wait, what the “response model is pretty good?” Even with a million gallon reservoir bone dry? Holy shit, I’d hate to see a “bad response!”